Wednesday, March 09, 2005

Breakaway Institute?

There have been some very interesting comments on the recent post "Welsh Rebellion" (see the comments section). Here are the two most recent posts:

"Why not have a poll to see how many ICAEW members would like to become members of ICAS or ACCA or a new Welsh Institute.

The consolidation outcome is certain though the timing is not. How many disgruntled ICAEW members want a new home unless Messrs A and D withdraw by say, 31st March.

Messrs Frost, Lawson, Wooller and the Ginger Group surely have enough combined clout and prospective financial support to test the strength of opinion."

"You guys should let us know if there is a address where by contribution is required to set up the new body. I believe a lot will join the new body!!!!"

The idea of forming a breakaway body, or joining another body, is to my view an action of "the last resort".

In my view the best way forward, at this stage, is for the ICAEW to be reformed from within. In the short term a number of actions need to be taken; to show that ICAEW is capable/willing to change, and listen to its members:

1 The office of president should be an elected office, whereby all the members have the opportunity to vote. The current situation whereby the office holder is appointed by Council is unsatisfactory.

2 The merger plans, and associated expenditure on road shows etc trying to convince us of its merits, should be stopped immediately.

3 The ICAEW should give us, the membership, a full accounting of the costs incurred to date of trying to persuade us to vote for this unwanted proposal.

4 The "board" of the ICAEW that pushed the proposal forward, despite the objections of the membership and of CIMA, should resign and submit themselves for re-election.

5 The ICAEW should review the size, structure and role of council.

The response of the ICAEW to these points will, I guess, determine how strongly the membership really feel about joining/starting up another body.

Please post you views, and tell your friends/colleagues about this site.


  1. I agree that breaking away should be the last resort but perhaps the threat of doing so may be the only thing to stop the Institute bandwaggon.

    If the qualifications can be ACA(Wales) and FCA(Wales) and the fees are lower than ICAEW then there could be a lot of takers.

    I would like to be first on the list!

  2. "Better late than never but better never late". I also think it is a question of how best to use all major weapons to force a quick surrender and an English Institute may also be fairly popular alternative to add to the list.

  3. I totally agree with points 2,3 and 5. Point 4 is a matter of honour and I hope point 1 would not be important with a smaller, new and enlightened council.

  4. I have to say that I am surprised at the support voiced for breaking away, at this stage.

    More views please.

  5. 11th May 1880? 125th anniversary brings no pride or celebration? It was England & Wales for the English and Welsh and those who came here to train. There are many many excellent accountants of different qualification, background and training but excellent Institutes are rare indeed. "The mountain sheep are sweeter but the valley sheep are fatter. We therefore deemed it meeter for to carry off the latter".

  6. The War Song of Dinas Vawr
    Thomas Love Peacock

    from: The Misfortunes of Elphin

    The mountain sheep are sweeter,
    But the valley sheep are fatter;
    We therefore deemed it meeter
    To carry off the latter.
    We made an expedition;
    We met a host, and quelled it;
    We forced a strong position,
    And killed the men who held it.

    This first verse is in accord with Dr Wooller's "off with their heads".

  7. Does anyone knows if the ICAEW read this board or any other board for opinions about the institute?

    Do they care may probably ne the better question!!!!

    Seems to me they are selling snake oil about the future including how positive the consolidation is (and without presenting any facts and figures). No smart accountant is going to buy or sell a business without knowing all the facts, unless the President and council of ICAEW thinks we CA are not that smart and can ramped the merger up our arse.

    If you check this and other site, all I hear is members will vote against the consolidation!!!!!

    What is it?

  8. My stats log shows a number of regular hits from ICAEW and CIMA, since this site was created.

    The Times City Diary today notes that the ICAEW gave "no comment", when asked about the opposition to the merger.